Comments on: Baby Daddy http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/ The Ramblings and 'Ritings of a Big-Dicked Country Boy Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:57:31 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: BIG18GUNZ http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4677 BIG18GUNZ Wed, 09 Aug 2006 00:33:49 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4677 i built a bookshelf once. all by myself, too. i never once wanted to abort it. eventually, however, it did sag in the middle, and i got rid of it. now i feel sad. i built a bookshelf once. all by myself, too. i never once wanted to abort it.
eventually, however, it did sag in the middle, and i got rid of it.
now i feel sad.

]]> By: Kevin http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4619 Kevin Mon, 07 Aug 2006 06:00:12 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4619 I'm not sure I would equate "moral objections" with "bonding before birth". I think it's entirely possible to have a non-religious, moral objection to abortion without laying any claim to prenatal bonding. For some, answering the question "when does it become human" is easy: right at the point where it becomes impossible for it to develop into anything BUT a human. If, at some early stage of gestation, an embryo or fetus of the homo sapiens species can develop into, say, a dog, a pig, or a chimp, then at that stage, sure, it's not human. But once its destiny is set, genetically, then it's a human. Oh wait... that's determined at conception. The real question is, once such a human exists, and assuming the absence of rape, if the mother has changed her mind as to whether she wishes to carry the baby to term, should she be permitted to abort the embryo/fetus/child? One can make a very reasonable argument that this is murder. In fact, the law is horribly inconsistent on this point: if a mother chooses to abort during the first trimester, no law can stop her; but if someone beats her up and causes a miscarriage, he can be charged with killing the child. That's pretty hard to square with the underlying rationale for abortion. The current status quo may lead to what some, or most, consider a "desirable" result--letting women escape the consequences of failed (or non-existent) birth control, which is the motivation behind most abortions. (Despite scare tactics about rape, incest, and deformed children, abortions carried out in those cases are a small fraction of the total.) But it's certainly not intellecutally defensible. I’m not sure I would equate “moral objections” with “bonding before birth”. I think it’s entirely possible to have a non-religious, moral objection to abortion without laying any claim to prenatal bonding.

For some, answering the question “when does it become human” is easy: right at the point where it becomes impossible for it to develop into anything BUT a human. If, at some early stage of gestation, an embryo or fetus of the homo sapiens species can develop into, say, a dog, a pig, or a chimp, then at that stage, sure, it’s not human. But once its destiny is set, genetically, then it’s a human.

Oh wait… that’s determined at conception.

The real question is, once such a human exists, and assuming the absence of rape, if the mother has changed her mind as to whether she wishes to carry the baby to term, should she be permitted to abort the embryo/fetus/child? One can make a very reasonable argument that this is murder.

In fact, the law is horribly inconsistent on this point: if a mother chooses to abort during the first trimester, no law can stop her; but if someone beats her up and causes a miscarriage, he can be charged with killing the child. That’s pretty hard to square with the underlying rationale for abortion.

The current status quo may lead to what some, or most, consider a “desirable” result–letting women escape the consequences of failed (or non-existent) birth control, which is the motivation behind most abortions. (Despite scare tactics about rape, incest, and deformed children, abortions carried out in those cases are a small fraction of the total.)

But it’s certainly not intellecutally defensible.

]]> By: GoOnBoB http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4607 GoOnBoB Sun, 06 Aug 2006 23:00:41 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4607 Pro choice all the way. every situation is different. as Moby said its not an easy decission to make, Having been there on one occasion with my ex wife. After having two children, I would never be with out them such a joy to watch and nurture. The option of having a third was not in our plans (and you can get pregnant while breast feeding) (and after a vasectomy.... still had one live one left) Bonding for a man, I believe you are correct yes we know its there but it's still just a moving bump. Until I survived watching the brutal process of child birth, Drug free (Which gives most men a greater respect for woman I think) I could not attach myself to a bump until I saw them. My Husband wants one of our own.. we will keep trying :) Pro choice all the way. every situation is different. as Moby said its not an easy decission to make,
Having been there on one occasion with my ex wife.
After having two children, I would never be with out them such a joy to watch and nurture. The option of having a third was not in our plans (and you can get pregnant while breast feeding) (and after a vasectomy…. still had one live one left)
Bonding for a man, I believe you are correct yes we know its there but it’s still just a moving bump. Until I survived watching the brutal process of child birth, Drug free (Which gives most men a greater respect for woman I think) I could not attach myself to a bump until I saw them.
My Husband wants one of our own.. we will keep trying :)

]]> By: sue http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4581 sue Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:35:04 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4581 When I was in high school, I volunteered at a clinic that did abortions on Long Island. What an eye opener. I met ladies that had 5 or more abortions. It was clear that they were using them as birth control. Just plain wrong in my book. I am prochoice, but that is rediculous. I have never had children or an abortion thanks to successful birth control. So, I can't help you guys out with the bonding issue. But I have to agree just based on observation that it is more for the woman. Had a close call or two which provided more motivation for better birth control. BTW - I am also a recovering Catholic. Makes me shudder to think about it. When I was in high school, I volunteered at a clinic that did abortions on Long Island. What an eye opener. I met ladies that had 5 or more abortions. It was clear that they were using them as birth control. Just plain wrong in my book. I am prochoice, but that is rediculous.

I have never had children or an abortion thanks to successful birth control. So, I can’t help you guys out with the bonding issue. But I have to agree just based on observation that it is more for the woman. Had a close call or two which provided more motivation for better birth control.

BTW - I am also a recovering Catholic. Makes me shudder to think about it.

]]> By: TonkaManOR http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4551 TonkaManOR Fri, 04 Aug 2006 16:18:17 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4551 The bible a book written by men intrepreting God's word. Just like any other book. As a recovered Catholic I have issues with people who believe they know what is written in the book. Especially the ones that are shocked that I, someone who does not attend church can actually quote more scripture than they, those that attend church every Sunday. It's why my friends no longer discuss religion with me...........see what 8 years of Catholic school does to you. The bible a book written by men intrepreting God’s word. Just like any other book. As a recovered Catholic I have issues with people who believe they know what is written in the book. Especially the ones that are shocked that I, someone who does not attend church can actually quote more scripture than they, those that attend church every Sunday. It’s why my friends no longer discuss religion with me………..see what 8 years of Catholic school does to you.

]]> By: BewilderedofLondon http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4545 BewilderedofLondon Fri, 04 Aug 2006 10:33:43 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4545 The blood bond is a pretty basic tribal one and isn't wholly born of love, though there's certainly a genetic and emotional component. I think you're right, for a man there's unlikely to be bond where there's no relationship although it's worth noting that men are otherwise more than capable of highly emotive displaced bonds where there is no direct inimacy whatsoever; sports, politics, religion, patriotism (and the billion other 'isms',) for example, so why not their genetic inheritance, a.k.a. their kid? But if we're talking about love, I think both men and women probably base it on history and relationship equally, it's just that the woman's parental relationship begins earlier in a more intimate physical way but it's essentially the same thing for both, just different timelines. I'm pro-choice but it is licensed killing, as is a verdict of death by injection or electric chair or the right to 'protect' one's self/tribe/country with a gun/missile/bomb. You sanction one, you sanction the other. The blood bond is a pretty basic tribal one and isn’t wholly born of love, though there’s certainly a genetic and emotional component.
I think you’re right, for a man there’s unlikely to be bond where there’s no relationship although it’s worth noting that men are otherwise more than capable of highly emotive displaced bonds where there is no direct inimacy whatsoever; sports, politics, religion, patriotism (and the billion other ‘isms’,) for example, so why not their genetic inheritance, a.k.a. their kid?
But if we’re talking about love, I think both men and women probably base it on history and relationship equally, it’s just that the woman’s parental relationship begins earlier in a more intimate physical way but it’s essentially the same thing for both, just different timelines.
I’m pro-choice but it is licensed killing, as is a verdict of death by injection or electric chair or the right to ‘protect’ one’s self/tribe/country with a gun/missile/bomb. You sanction one, you sanction the other.

]]> By: Curtis http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4535 Curtis Fri, 04 Aug 2006 03:17:57 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4535 I have definite opinions on the subject that are, in fact, too detailed to state in a blog comment. Suffice it to say that I agree (in most part) if it doesn't directly affect you, then stay out of it. I have secretes too -- and keep them well. Oh yeah, I don't really get into being pissed on either. Just for the record. I have definite opinions on the subject that are, in fact, too detailed to state in a blog comment. Suffice it to say that I agree (in most part) if it doesn’t directly affect you, then stay out of it.

I have secretes too — and keep them well.

Oh yeah, I don’t really get into being pissed on either. Just for the record.

]]> By: Todd/Imnot2bzy http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4534 Todd/Imnot2bzy Fri, 04 Aug 2006 03:16:02 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4534 I'm not against it. I could give a more long winded answer. But, I'll share that later. No beatings with the bible from me. I’m not against it. I could give a more long winded answer. But, I’ll share that later. No beatings with the bible from me.

]]> By: moby http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4533 moby Fri, 04 Aug 2006 01:52:29 +0000 http://blog.largetony.com/2006/08/03/baby-daddy/#comment-4533 Interesting post. I think it is possible for a guy to bond early on but I agree its much more of an intimate connection for the women. It's easy for us guys to pass judgement since we don't have to carry the child. The irony of this topic is we wouldn't have so many unwanted pregnancies in the first place were it not for antiquated teachings of abstinance as the only form of contraception. I lean toward pro-choice however, I'm of the mind every situation is different and its never an easy choice. But, it should not be used as a form on contraception because your too lazy to use a condom. Interesting post. I think it is possible for a guy to bond early on but I agree its much more of an intimate connection for the women. It’s easy for us guys to pass judgement since we don’t have to carry the child.

The irony of this topic is we wouldn’t have so many unwanted pregnancies in the first place were it not for antiquated teachings of abstinance as the only form of contraception.

I lean toward pro-choice however, I’m of the mind every situation is different and its never an easy choice. But, it should not be used as a form on contraception because your too lazy to use a condom.

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